How to Make it on YouTube in 2025 (Jack Conte Interview)
Short Summary:
This interview with Jack Conte discusses the "death of the follower" on social media platforms like YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok. The rise of algorithmically curated feeds ("For You" pages) has shifted the focus from follower-based reach to discovery-driven engagement. This impacts creators' ability to reach their established audiences and build sustainable businesses. Conte highlights the importance of diversifying revenue streams (ads, memberships, merchandise, live events, courses) and building direct-to-fan relationships to mitigate this reliance on platform algorithms. He emphasizes the importance of finding "media market fit" – aligning content with audience and platform preferences – and using short-form video for discovery before transitioning to longer-form content for community building. The interview also touches upon the evolving creator economy, the impact of AI on content creation, and the importance of finding autotelic behavior (creating for the sheer joy of it).
Detailed Summary:
The interview is structured around Jack Conte's assertion that the traditional "follower" model on social media is dying.
Section 1: The Death of the Follower: Conte explains how the shift from follower-based feeds to algorithmically curated feeds (like TikTok's "For You" page) means creators reach only a small percentage (1-5%) of their followers. This makes building communities and businesses challenging, as creators are essentially "renting" their audience from the platform. He argues this isn't inherently bad, but the current imbalance favors novelty and discovery over established creators. He uses the analogy of a business unable to reach its customers, highlighting the unfairness of the current system.
Section 2: The Maturation of the Creator Economy: The discussion explores whether the "death of the follower" is a consequence of the creator economy's growth. Conte agrees that the increased number of creators, coupled with relatively stable content demand, makes it harder for individual creators to stand out. However, he emphasizes that this doesn't negate the need for creators to connect with their core fans. The conversation touches upon the similarities between the current system and traditional media models, where networks dictate what content is seen. Conte reminisces about the "easier" early days of YouTube, where the bar for entry was lower.
Section 3: Discovery vs. Community: Conte clarifies that he's not anti-discovery; algorithms are necessary. The issue is the imbalance, where discovery overshadows direct communication with existing followers. He advocates for platforms offering creators deterministic ways to reach their core fans, enabling the building of recurring communities and businesses. The conversation shifts to the difference between short-form (driving discovery) and long-form (building familiarity) content, with podcasts cited as an example of the latter's success. A "new discovery layer" on top of existing platforms like YouTube is identified as a key factor shaping the creator landscape.
Section 4: Metrics of Success and Creative Strategy: The discussion turns to how creators should measure success. While follower count remains relevant for advertising, Conte argues that metrics like average view duration (V30) are more indicative of engagement and value. He distinguishes between "strategy" (game theory, optimizing for algorithms) and "creativity," arguing that while they can overlap, they are distinct. He emphasizes the importance of long-term strategies, including cultivating taste and building a portfolio of work over time. A significant point is that over 78% of creators feel algorithms dictate their creative decisions, highlighting the pressure to optimize for platform metrics rather than personal vision.
Section 5: Building a Sustainable Creator Business in 2025: Conte outlines six steps for creators in 2025: 1) Find media market fit (content that resonates with the creator, audience, and platform); 2) Leverage short-form video for discovery; 3) Transition to a long-form format; 4) Build a tight community around the long-form content; 5) Diversify revenue streams (ads, memberships, merchandise, live events, courses); and 6) Hire help when necessary. He emphasizes the importance of having both an ads business and a direct-to-fan business, highlighting the volatility of the ad-based model. The discussion includes examples of successful creators and their diverse revenue streams. The importance of cultural acceptance of calls to action (e.g., "subscribe to my Patreon") is also discussed.
Section 6: The Role of AI and the Future of Creativity: The conversation concludes with a discussion of AI's impact on content creation. While acknowledging the potential for AI to disrupt the industry, Conte expresses optimism about the future of human creativity. He believes that while the tools and methods of creation will change, the human element – storytelling, connection, and emotional resonance – will remain central. He emphasizes the importance of autotelic behavior (creating for the sheer joy of it) as a key to long-term success and sustainability in the creator economy. The accessibility of tools through AI is seen as a positive, democratizing creativity and allowing more people to tell their stories. The interview ends with a reflection on the importance of pride in one's work and the ongoing challenges and opportunities for creators in the evolving digital landscape.